Home Office plans to introduce an English language test for those coming to Britain to marry UK citizens could breach human rights and race relations laws, according to leading human rights lawyers. A legal opinion by Matrix Chambers, said the decision to impose the test from November has more to do with reducing the number of immigrants to Britain than minimising abuse.
The Matrix legal opinion was commissioned by the human rights group Liberty. Its director, Shami Chickenkebabi, warned that the opinion would form the basis of a high court challenge if the tests, which will affect more than 25,000 spouses a year, go ahead.
And your point is...? Immigrants coming here who can't speak English is a breach of our Human Rights in this country. There are thousands if not millions in this country who can't speak English and have no intention of learning it. And you're right, I'm thinking particularly of Asian families. So if they don't want to integrate into British society and adopt the host culture, then they shouldn't be coming here!
57 comments:
Old Slotgob works for Matrix so that'll be a few more quid for the Blairs heirs, don't suppose she'll be doing that one pro fucking bono.
Yes but it'll be here in court getting the legal aid (your link doesn't work btw).
Banned, probably. I'll repair it.
Banned, sorry I didn't provide a link in this. I thought you were talking about the leadership story. It was in the Guardian.
You crack me up DL - Shami Chickenkebabi. I spat my tea all over my monitor (it was needing a clean anyway LOL).
But you're right. Shami's Liberty is a joke. All it is is a protection quango/charity there to help non indigenous Brits to get their own way all the time.
I remember sending them off an email to enquire why they hadn't defended the Heretical Two (Simon Shepherd and Stephen Whittle). No reply.
They've got about as much in common with liberty as a male dog has in giving birth to puppies.
I'd like to see Shami and the rest of her wankers dropped from a Hercules, over India without a parachute.
I don't think an inability to speak English upon arrival is necessarily an indication of an unwillingness to integrate.
I also don't believe this will really do anything to reduce the number of people coming to the UK, it seems like an unnecessary piece of beauracracy (presumably, these English tests will not be free, and prospective spouses will have to pay for textbooks, lessons, exam fees etc) which isn't going to deter anyone, whether they want to come here to marry or not.
What I would say however is that you are right about there being groups of people in this country who don't have a decent standard of English. While at school I had a part time job at a bakery, reading the owner's post to him, as both he and his wife had learned to speak, but not to read or write in English. We should probably work towards bringing people like this up to speed rather than targetting newly-weds.
Yowza,
DL said," Immigrants coming here who can't speak English is a breach of our Human Rights in this country."
Puzzling,how so?
DL said,There are thousands if not millions in this country who can't speak English and have no intention of learning it.
Evidence,links!!!!!!!
DL said,"So if they don't want to integrate into British society and adopt the host culture, then they shouldn't be coming here!"
Not having English as a first language is not proof of a desire to be separated from the mainstream,personally I believe people should be left alone to live their own lives even if that means living with a hundred stuffed cats,praying to a can of baked beans and speaking mumbo jumbo to your best friend a gooseberry bush.
Harbingers, oh I would give them a parachute but I wouldn't give them a re-entry visa to this country. Liberty under Shami have forgotten what their core intentions were when it was set up. To highlight injustices in other countries, that is what it should stick to.
Faither, no I would agree that it isn't an unwillingness to learn, but is that the intention? I would add further that prospective spouses should go and live with their newly wed spouse in their country and bring them up to speed before they are brought here. That way I won't have to pay out of my taxes to have translators standing by in all sorts of situations around the country because they don't have a decent standard of English. I think particularly of the NHS. Funny situation when they could speak English but couldn't read it. What nationality were they. Mind you even using the word 'nationality' which the dictionary defines as being, 'the condition of being a member of a particular nation', means that they aren't part of the British nation, does it not?
Stanners, this blog is based on the fact, that I say what I think. Now if you agree that's fine if you don't agree, them we can discuss it in an orderly way, which hopefully will be interesting.
Now in saying that I often provide links to the subject that I am talking about and sometimes I don't, because basically I'm a lazy bastard and I can't be arsed.
Now, it is a breach of our human rights because they aren't able to take part in this society that we have because they can't speak English. We have to provide support services for them to back them up.
If you've ever been involved with Asian people as I have at some times in my sales career, you will realise that there are many of them, mostly women who can't speak English and in many cases have no intention of learning it. There is no need for them to learn, because their immediate family speak nothing but their native language whether or not they can also speak English.
We are at last in agreement! Because, I also believe that people should be left alone to live their own lives. Our only difference is that I believe they should be doing it in their own countries and allowing US to live our own lives as a white, European, Christian country!
Greetings,
DL said,"Now, it is a breach of our human rights because they aren't able to take part in this society that we have because they can't speak English. We have to provide support services for them to back them up."
Still dont get how someone "not taking part in this society" is a breach of your human rights,if someone is not involved with you or your particular society then they are not affecting you are they?,as for "support services",well Asians pay their taxes too you know.
DL said,"If you've ever been involved with Asian people as I have at some times in my sales career, you will realise that there are many of them, mostly women who can't speak English and in many cases have no intention of learning it. There is no need for them to learn, because their immediate family speak nothing but their native language whether or not they can also speak English."
No doubt some cant speak English whether they intend to or not who knows,but thats up to them IMHO.
DL said,"allowing US to live our own lives as a white, European, Christian country!"
Ive not heard of anyone stopping you being white and European,as for religion,well each of us is responsible for our own soul!
DL,
There are many people who come straight from Pakistan and Bangladesh who will never speak English for there is no reason to. We (as you will know) constantly pamper them - "Can't speak English? Don't worry we've got 40 or so different language translators to help you." How many do we get when we goto other countries?
Bottom line is a simple one and that is we shouldn't be letting people into the UK period. There is one way to stop prejudice (read racism) and that is to stop bringing in non indigenous to the UK and preferably removing all non indigenous out. I'd do exactly the same for all whites in non white lands and non whites in non white lands also. That way no one would have anything to complain about whatsoever as they'd be living in their own lands, with their own people in their own culture.
Non Indigenous who come to the UK shouldn't learn our culture as it's not theirs. They should be learning their own, yet this ultimately causes a problem in that as they grow they will pose a threat to the indigenous people and their culture. That's why we fought war after war in the past to stop cultural displacement and annihilation.
As the non white population in this country grows there will be problems. Those problems are 100% indigenous identity to one another, choosing (naturally) to associate with those of same kind. So in effect racialism is prevalent within every race as birds of a feather stick together.
I'll read what Stan has to say but again, proves overwhelmingly why I say what I do of him, in that he can never relate to the way you and I and many indigenous in the UK think because he is an African black who happened to be born in the UK. Our culture is not nor will it ever be his, hence he, from immigrants himself will always defend them and their freedoms (as his parents had) to come here and live how they should so choose.
The problem with all of this is that one day there will be a recoil. The indigenous people are being pushed further and further back and one day they'll say enough is enough. It's inevitable. In fact it's already happening.
The non indigenous population of any land should be no more than 3-5% max. That way no problems arise, but there is because it's far larger than people think. No doubt the indigenous population is somewhere around 70 odd percent with the non indigenous around 20-25% and that figure is more than likely to continue to grow while the indigenous of course drops.
You can't win against it DL. You just have to accept it. The UK's dead and will only get worse. Hell, even socialist shitheads like Emma Thompson are moaning on about children not being able to speak properly when her and her luvvies, by supporting NuLabour have created it. LMAO!!
My brother stays in Denmark and the only way you get to stay there is if you can speak the language. So where is the problem - if you have got to learn the local lingo in other countries why not here?
Ahoy land-lubber`s,
Did you know black men from Africa and The Windies served in the Royal Navy under Nelson and Indians....even at the Battle of Trafalgar..brave souls!,protecting our freedoms!
Respec.....
Things aint always as black and white as they seem eh!
DL said,Stanners, My ancestors over many hundreds of years have made this 'society' what it is.
Wow mine too!,see above....
DL said,P.S. when have you ever known a Pakistani to pay the proper taxes.
Well Im assuming they pay proper taxes,but then I dont work for the tax office so I wouldnt know for sure......
DL said,A Pakistani moved into one of them and he's not here 3 weeks and already he is trying to put the rest out of business, selling papers at half price etc. The Bastard!
Whoooo there,thats business,anyways its simple,dont shop there!
DL said,. Her son sometimes displays traits that would make him a Muslim,
Eh!...how so?
Hey up!,
Ha,your applying Harby`s Law,quoting selectivly and making lots of assumptions pal...let me elp ya!
Harby,to quote fully I said,
I defend anyones right to live as they choose, not just immigrants.
So long as they are not robbing ,stabbing etc.....;)
I think you could add stoning etc without too much of a stretch of your imagination...;)
Stan,
You just don't get it, but then I won't ever expect you to considering I'm discussing indigenous (and British national, matters) with an African. You've decided to call it "Harby's Law" when again, you're oblivious to understanding what the definition of Briton is and of Britain - the four lands that make it up and their respective 'INDIGENOUS PEOPLES' and subsequent cultures. I've explained this over and over and you still have a problem understanding it, for obvious reasons that you have grown up in a land that is not of your people and thus live in a cultural/national limbo. You are however not alone.
By not allowing Muslims to impose Sharia Law it would mean that you would not be defending another's right to live as they choose. Would you defend a skinhead who wanted all blacks out of the UK? After all that's his right to live as he so chooses is it not? Would you defend an employer who chose only to employ white staff even though it was detrimental to you and your people? No you wouldn't, so less of the "I defend anyone's right to live as they choose."
Sharia Law isn't just about stoning, although it's certainly part of it and with Sharia it comes as a bundle, that can't be split up - the same with Islam. In fact it's the same as most religions in that you follow what the teacher tells (normally the main person within that faith) and if you do not then you cannot call yourself a follower of that faith. For example, the deadhead gangbangers in the USA, with their gold, diamond encrusted, bling-bling crucifixes around their necks, yet off around LA in their blacked out chevrolets performing drive byes...hmm....very Christian.
Now you may support anyone's right to live as they choose but you would most certainly will not ever defend it, after all, you'd look like a real plum walking behind the KKK carrying a sign stating - I defend anyone's right to live as they choose wouldn't you? Not only that you'd be called an Uncle Tom, a coconut and no doubt on the Black Panthers' list of 'those to be executed.'
I would add further that prospective spouses should go and live with their newly wed spouse in their country and bring them up to speed before they are brought here.
I don't think that really would work, it is far easier to learn a language when you are in that country, and it doesn't make a lot of sense for a newly wed to travel to their partner's country where the two of them have no intention of living to prepare for the two of them to move back.
If it is the tax you are worried about, how about instead of the current system where you aren't entitled to benefits etc until you've lived in the UK for three years, at the end of the three years you are asked to sit an English test?
As for the translators, I don't think you're ever going to get rid of those as long as you have tourists etc.
Stanners, now I have been away for a few hours doing other things in my life, well watching the football actually and taking the cats to the vets, so please excuse me if I take your posting one at a time, because I see you and 'Harby Baby' have being going at hammer and tongs. I don't have a problem with "I defend anyones right to live as they choose, not just immigrants". So do I. Where you and I differ is that I want them to do it in their own country! I was aware that there were some blacks who took part in the Battle of Trafalgar, they like the Many, many Scots, were cannon fodder below decks, because basically the English can't fight as ferociously as a Scot as has been proved throughout history. There was of course also a racial element to it.
Billy, I would totally agree and I would also say that if anyone wants to fuck off to Spain from Britain to get some heat in their old bones the same should apply. I speak, well used to speak Spanish to a decent level and it is fucking embarrassing listening to Brits in Spain, trying to speak Spanish and I'm talking about the ones who live there for long periods. I know they all speak English but that's not the point.
Stanners, I don't shop there for any items that the other shops sell and when did I say, "DL said,. Her son sometimes displays traits that would make him a Muslim" and in what context?
HARBY BABY, that's cracking me up. I don't see you as a Harby Baby, so we'll just say, "Taxi for Harby Baby"! Anyway, Stan doesn't have any concept of how the British physis has evolved over the years. That is why we have been so successful at taking over other countries. Take India for instance. a huge sub-continent ruled by a silly wee country on the outer reaches of Europe. Do these conquered people never wander what makes us different to them?
Stanners, by bringing up stoning you are only ridiculing your own argument.
Harbingers, I think he is either stupid, which I don't believe or he is being deliberately obtuse!
I know DL,
Not just India, but Africa, North America, much of the West Indies, while fighting against other advanced European nations. It's just the way it is. Stan won't understand it because Stan's definition of British is anyone born here, therefore Anjem Choudary would of course be British to him along with every other born in Britain anti British/pro their own country citizen in the UK. It's just the way it goes though. There's a clear difference to Britain that was for centuries and the last 50 years after the war.
Faither, you make some decent points. I suggested the idea of the prospective spouse and it usually the Groom going to the country of his wife for a couple of reasons. One, it would stop being ordering wives out of a book, as is the case with Thai women and it would also stop the custom of Asian and I am thinking particularly of the Indian sub-continent having marriages arranged with their cousins, which is damaging the genetics of that family. I did blogpost on it a few weeks ago and there was a programme on Channel 4. I don't know if you say either. I'm not sure if a test in English would help, because what would happen if they failed it. They were to be sent back? What is they had had children in that 3 years? No, IMHO, sending the spouse to live with them would work and it would also cut down on 'marriages of convenience' which go on all the time in fact there was some Vicar just jailed for it.
Harbingers, There's a huge difference and all these immigrants from the Commonwealth haven't helped the spirit or backbone of the nation! Look at the state of the country. It's a cesspit of halfwits and naewits. Fuck me!
You know it's ironic, but when British people go to India, there's nothing but the greatest respect from them, that outside the Muslim areas, because the Hindus and the Sikhs realised how much beauty they created in India and how much we gave them.
I remember reading a James Delingpole article when he was wandering through Africa and met a local in some part of a former British Colony. The person was most irate, seeing his society go down the tubes to which he simply stated - "Why did you [The British] leave us [to the shit we live in today]?"
Watching a TV broadcast a while back, some Irish journalist, typical left winger, went to South Africa and interviewed the locals. Apart from having the shit scared out of him by kids whom had robbed and murdered people, getting more and more drunk, they then decided that they wanted all the camera equipment and pretty much everything else which meant a quick exit for them.
The hilarious part of the documentary was when he went to a shanty town in Sowetto, no electric and people were burning gasoline I think filling the place with putrid fumes to cook their food and keep warm. He interviewed a local, unemployed and cursing the ANC and Zulu movements. The journalist then said: "You speak as though you wish you were under White rule again and apartheid?" to which the man replied [paraphrasing] "Yes, I do. At least under their rule there was law and order, no constant murders and robbings, not forgetting we had jobs and could feed and raise our families in security."
It sort of axed this journalists left wing views, not realising that Africans in Africa were far better off under colonialism and white rule that under present black, despot rule and that came from the blacks - LOL!
But that's the way it is. Our culture and society is being demolished because it worked and opposed tyranny. The NWO want tyranny and total control with zero liberty and thus must destroy the old order completely before they can install the new - hence why they created Communism, the means to utterly obliterate the white, western society.
Harbingers, I've posed the question before and I have yet to get a credible answer from anyone, I am Stan, included. What Commonwealth country is better now than when the white man was in charge. In fact I'll expand that to any country which is better under independence than when the Europeans or the European diaspora was in charge?
Good morning me old muckers,
Harby said,By not allowing Muslims to impose Sharia Law it would mean that you would not be defending another's right to live as they choose. Would you defend a skinhead who wanted all blacks out of the UK? After all that's his right to live as he so chooses is it not? Would you defend an employer who chose only to employ white staff even though it was detrimental to you and your people? No you wouldn't, so less of the "I defend anyone's right to live as they choose."
Let me clarify,under English law I would not allow Sharia law to be IMPOSED on others,however if you voluntarly want to live in an area under Sharia then that would be your choice and you would not be prevented,however violence against the person or property would not be tolerated and would be punished.
I would and have defend a skin heads right to his opinion,and if he wanted to live in an area with like minded people where there were no Darkies etc then that thats fine with me.However violence against minorities or anyone else for that matter and property would not be tolerated.
If an employer only wanted to employ one legged,one eyed scientologist`s then that would be up to them,its their business.I would either start my own business or find employment else where,and I would not buy their products or use their services.
I would defend anyones right to live as they choose,however violence against the person or their property would not be tolerated and would be punished harshly.
Do and live as you wish,just dont harm others or their property,simple!
Hey up duck!,
DL said,Harbingers, I've posed the question before and I have yet to get a credible answer from anyone, I am Stan, included. What Commonwealth country is better now than when the white man was in charge. In fact I'll expand that to any country which is better under independence than when the Europeans or the European diaspora was in charge?
The Commonwealth was born of colonialism,
I believe colonialism is wrong,it involves force, death,enslavement,theft of resources,a weaker country and people being forced to comply to foreign desires,needs and laws.
When Colonialists are forced out the vacuum is often filled with warriors,despots and the rule of the gun,Colonialists rarely if ever leave a country volutarily and never leave it a peacefull,lawful place.
It takes decades,centuries for countrys to rebuild their own culture.
Countrys should be left to develop in their own way and in their own time,Im not against trade or passive involvement,I`m all for it ,but occupation and domination of weaker less aggressive country`s and peoples is wrong and nothing to be proud of.I believe its better to be free of tyranny and to fail or succeed in your own way and time than to be forced by the barrel of a gun and the threat of death or imprisonment to comply and make a foreign power wealthy....
The Commonwealth is a complex issue,to ask which country is better off than when the "white man was in charge" is far too complex a question to answer properly in a blog comments format,for what its worth I would rather live free and fail than live under a tyranny and be forced to comply with their and their puppets ambitions.
You should ask what your contribution is DL/HARBY not bask in the glory of past conquerer`s,what have you done lately?
;)
Stanners, So you would have some parts of the country where Sharia law was imposed and others where you had to be a skinheid to survive? What do you have against scientologists? It seems to me if you want to believe in sky fairies then their ideas are just as credible as 'your father up in the sky' routine. It would indeed be a very strange country if you were in charge. This is the point we are making. Much better to leave it to the native peoples of this land who have experience in this sort of thing.
The thing is that you see it as domination of countries. We see it as bringing education. Some of these African countries would still be living in the dark ages if we hadn't 'discovered' them. "I believe its better to be free of tyranny and to fail or succeed in your own way and time than to be forced by the barrel of a gun and the threat of death or imprisonment to comply and make a foreign power wealthy...." Excellent but if that is the case why do all the population want to come here? I still haven't had an adequate answer to the question I posed about which country is better now. Can you name one? As usual you are floundering.......!
Yo,
DL said,Excellent but if that is the case why do all the population want to come here? I still haven't had an adequate answer to the question I posed about which country is better now. Can you name one? As usual you are floundering.......!
Mmmm for a start not "all" the population want to come here,the vast majority stay where they are,"which country is better now",I dont know and neither do you,I haven`t been to them all and neither have you.
DL said,Some of these African countries would still be living in the dark ages if we hadn't 'discovered' them.
Really,you have a crystal ball then?,how different would these counrtys be now if they had been left alone to develop in their own time and way instead of being forced to comply to western avarice.
Ps,I have already explained I do not believe in forcing anyone to live in a particular way and I have nothing against Scientologist`s or folks with one eye,do you actually read my comments?
You are a hypocrite,first you say
"Much better to leave it to the native peoples of this land who have experience in this sort of thing. "
Then you say
"The thing is that you see it as domination of countries. We see it as bringing education. Some of these African countries would still be living in the dark ages if we hadn't 'discovered' them."
So its ok for other native`s to be ruled by force but your own natives should be left alone.
Double standards and hypocrisy...
Stanners, not at all. The African people were eating each other in 1920 as documented by Harbingers in another thread. For all I know they might still be eating each other. It was probably the first attempt at recycling that when someone died, the elders made hyena noises to scar the kids and took the body and cut it up for a tasty treat for the tribe. Fuck me. Less than 90 years ago, how creepy is that?
We haven't ruled the. All we have done is to show them the delights of civilisation and then left them to it. What country does Britain rule now? Apart from a few protectorates, I can't think of any. No, No. The British have brought civilisation to two thirds of the world and you Darkies, (your word), should be eternally grateful to the British. Talking about words. It's very strange to me that you Darkies go about calling each other 'nigger', but if a White man says it, it's racist. Why is that?
Adam says to Eve, "go and ask God if we're white"? Eve goes to God and asks, "God are we white"? God says, "you are what you are". Eve goes back to Adam and he asks, "What did God say"? "He said you are what you are", says Eve. Adam says, "Oh we must be white then because if we had have been Black, he would have said, you is what you is".
Now is that joke racist, or does it just illustrate the difference in the way the two races speak English?
Yowza DL,
"The African people"...no a tiny minority,cannibalism happens world wide,even in Europe,anyone can trawl the net for a horror story and them proclaim it to represent an entire country,continent or race,its lazy and narrow thinking!,Im sure Harb`s will be along soon to back you up ;)
DL said, It's very strange to me that you Darkies go about calling each other 'nigger', but if a White man says it, it's racist. Why is that?
I dont call anyone Nigger nor does anyone I know,just because some gangster rappers,wigga`s and wannabe`s do does not make it mainstream black language..how naive to think so.
If someone came up to me and shouted nigger in my face I would be offended,if someone shouted whitey in your face you would be,its not the word`s but the context they are used.
DL said,Adam says to Eve, "go and ask God if we're white"? Eve goes to God and asks, "God are we white"? God says, "you are what you are". Eve goes back to Adam and he asks, "What did God say"? "He said you are what you are", says Eve. Adam says, "Oh we must be white then because if we had have been Black, he would have said, you is what you is".
Now is that joke racist, or does it just illustrate the difference in the way the two races speak English?
Not racist in my opinion quite funny in fact,but it does illustrate different uses in language,Im surprised you consider it such a literal example of racial differences,a tiny minority of blacks speak like that,deep American south I imagine,who knows,nobody I know speaks like that anyway and I suspect I know a lot more black people than you do.
You seem to see things through stereotypes...as if you have minimal experience with other types of people and places so have no other reference,a simplistic way of viewing issues and people.
I am Stan,
Hmm....
If you allow Sharia Law and the Muslim community continues to rise and is the majority then how on earth do you stop them from imposing Sharia on all?
If a skin head and the movement grow so large as to get the right to start moving blacks out of the UK, then you'd defend their right to do so, even if it meant you being removed?
Well that is incredibly free thinking of you.
And if all employers started to only employ white people, with your own company failing because no one bought your goods, you'd be in a pickle wouldn't you? However again, admirable views.
I respect your views Stan. You are certainly far from stupid there's no doubt about that, but you seem to miss the bigger picture that multiculturalism and multiracialism within a foreign land create future problems through mere demographic birthrate. I mentioned all the above for a specific reason in that they are all distinct possibilities of our future in the UK.
I agree we shouldn't harm one another or damage their property. That goes without saying. However they are the outcome of multicultural and multiracial society.
You will always never be British for reasons explained but it is certainly clear that you are the epitome of the integrated 'foreigner' into an alien culture and society. To use your definition, you do 'run with the pack' and there's no doubt in my mind with that. However Stan you are clearly a minority with your views.
And I don't need to back up DL. He can do a perfectly good job on his own. This is not a gang up, merely two people disagreeing with your views, who have similar views and nothing more.
There are some simple facts to understand here Stan in that:
1. Had there been no European involvement within Africa you would still be living today as you had before we arrived.
2. There would be practically zero blacks within the west and certainly none in the USA, West Indies, Central and Southern America had there been no slave trade.
Now I agree that there should have been no colonialism, but regardless, there was and that enabled your people to get to our lands. It also enabled your people to shine within the brilliance of the western civlisation. You are the product of a western civilisation and completely different to your people in Africa. Your parents realised the benefits of a British life to an African one, hence why they moved. (cont)
Stanners, White men eating each other. Away and throw shite at yourself. No, No. I'm not putting up with that. Maybe that bunch who were tuck on the mountain after the air crash, but that was a necessity, not a matter of personal culinary choice!
BTW, I would not in the least be offended if some one shouted, "whitey" in my face. In fact I am quite a mid brownish tan. Well as tanned as you can get in the west of Scotland without going to a salon. Let ma assure you that I do not need Harbinger, 'to back me up', I am more than capable of being racist on my own. I would hope you know a lot more black people than I do, presumably your family are black. I run the joke past you because I told that to a whitey and he told me it was racist. I can now tell him it isn't.
So how do you and your black mates communicate. Obviously you are fairly intelligent, possibly more so that them? Do you give each other 'high fives' and all that Blacky stuff?
Harbingers, I agree with you for a change.
DL,
Well that's nice to see...for a change.
LOL
And also to Stan,
On cannibalism I agree that there were white Cannibals and ironically in DL's neck of the woods - Sawney Bean
However, regarding Africa Stan, you don't have a leg to stand on. It only evolved (that's if you call what's going on today evolving) because of white European influence. It took the ingenuity and intelligence of the western Caucasian peoples to create the west. Were the black people capable of the same they'd have done it a long, long time ago. In fact they'd have easily repulsed the European invaders, small in number but possessing far better weaponry, technology and superior battle winning skills.
Sadly Africa (and blacks in the west) continues to wallow in victim mentality. It is a case that Africa hasn't advanced and blacks because white men hold them back. This has been debunked on numerous occasions. For example Tony Sewell of Reading University (a black man) stated:
" What we now see in schools is children undermined by poor parenting, peer-group pressure and an inability to be responsible for their own behaviour.
They are not subjects of institutional racism. They have failed their GCSEs because they did not do the homework, did not pay attention and were disrespectful to their teachers."
The picture presented shows the simple fact that as blacks begin to form groups, shun the culture of the land they live in (UK/west) they go back to African, tribal mentality. Take the documentary on the TV of the young black kid who was taken out of an all black, rough school in London and sent to an all white, expensive one. His grades drastically improved which again only goes to strengthen my statement that blacks only excel (intellectually) in white cultures. You are what you are because you are the product of white culture, most certainly not white.
Blacks are given the push by whites to excel, yet who pushed the whites? We did and that's the point. Blacks will have a natural affinity to succeeding at sports and music. Whites excel in all. So to say that we are superior intellectually as a collective race is not racist merely fact. To say that blacks excel at physical sports is not racist but also a fact and thus are superior to whites. We have our pluses and our minuses. That's life.
Lastly Stan,
The following statement that I'll make will be rebuked but most certainly cannot be debunked.
The western civilisation is far superior to any other on this planet in all fields from arts to technology. The western Civilisation (although comprising of Japan)is first and foremost a Caucasian civlisation. It is therefore obvious to assume that a civilisation is the collective know how of its people who created it. Therefore the Caucasians who created are therefore superior to those of 2nd/3rd world lands. Moreso, our superiority is further shown by the one way migration to it from these lands.
Now you can look at that as much as you can. You will certainly rebuke it but you cannot state it as a falsehood.
Nature by definition is racist - birds of a feather stick together. We are also the products of nature and nurture. It doesn't mean we all can't get along and work together, but if the Caucasians become a minority within their own civilisations, then there's a very, very high possibility that our culture and society will thus disappear under a quagmire of fighting 2nd & 3rd world cultures for supremacy. This has happened throughout time and there will be no difference here to that formula.
It's the footy for me, back later!
Harbingers, it's no wonder their kids in Africa can't excel, some Tribal Chief is eating them while they're still tender, washed down with a little Muza Juice.
~I could not be bother reading all the posts instead felt I would just jump right in with my unworthy opinion.
I draw a distinction between Race/Ethnicity and Culture.
Black, Brown, White, Yellow are all full of the same potential to be great. There are some differences between the different races regarding physical characteristics but not mental ones.
However "culturally" the environment that a person develops within definately affects there mental development.
If we firstly take the example of India/Pakistan at Partiition. India has gone onto to become a world leader in industry, maths, science and technology.
Compare to Pakistan which is a total shit hole full of people living in the dark ages with a few pockets of rich internationalists.
Genetically they are exactly the same but they have been raised with different education systems and ideals.
Now as for the South African discussion.
Like Europeans the Africans differentiate between tribal nations in the same way we do. They hate each other as much as they hate whites.
Assuming there are about 20 tribal groups in Southern Africa all but the "San" are recent immigrants and the San have been displaced into the Desert after being targeted by the other tribes.
The largest Black community in Southern Africa is the Zulu and they arrived their after the Europeans.
Many of the other Blacks in south Africa arrived from other countries looking for work in the mining industry.
The "Coloureds" who are the mix race group of ex Malaysians/Indian slaves mixed with White and Black after being shipped to Africa to work in the colonies.
The simplified victimhood explanation of the White man came and enslaved all the happy little blacks and stole their land is nonsense. There was nothing to steal it was just wilderness and hunter gatherer tribes people who lived in sparse groups over a vast area in souther africa.
The Zulu came south to attack the whites and steal what had been built but failed until recently when it was all handed over to them by the anti appartied movement.
Now most of the other tribes live in fear from Zulu violence in the townships.
Positions in government are still held by a minority of tribal chief families and the poor are living in poverty.
South Africa will be like Zimbabwe in 20 years time.
Look at the many socialist all black governments in Africa and show me a single place where there is justice, law and order and respect for anyone.
It is not about black ore white it is about advanced culture and bronze age culture.
The lefty liberal doo-gooder vegan eating sandal wearers cannot bear to criticise the behaviour of the black governments nor the post appartied South Africa yet all have been made worse in the last 50 years.
Culturally Africa was on the whole not ready for post colonialism much like Britain was not ready when the Romans left. It is not a race issue simply a statement of fact that the native people of Both Africa and Britain were better off with Law and Order.
Eventually things will balance out but the problems of Africa are not only the Whiteman but to a much greater extent it is the organisational collapse of the institutions that creates a free for all environment were terror and violence always defeat sandal wearing candle lit vigils.
DL,
With Reference to the Immigration Policy of a small island nation I have the following parable.(Which I am about to make up)
"And so it came to pass that the Lefty Vegan Socialist middle classes of Londonistan who worked in the media, BBC or some cushy civil service job reserved for the children buggered at private schools, decided that a good idea would be to let anyone with a good story enter and claim benefits from the state while being provided for financially by the natives of our good land.
A profit from Loch Na Gar who still remembered the old ways of working and contributing to the state as the main criteria required to benefit from said state handouts held a sermon.
He said unto the idealist lefty fuckwitt.
"You work at the BBC" and the man nodded "You receive a large salary for doing fuck all" again the man nodded " You agree with uncapped immigration" Once again the fuckwitt did nod.
The Dark Prophet then said unto him " Suppose you meet an assylum seeker in need of assistance along the road. Would you help him?"
"It would be my socialaly responsible duty in a multicultural utopia" replied the fuckwitt.
The Prophet continued" Then would you invite him into your home and pay all his expenses, medical, legal ande allow him to shag your daughter. Would you build him a house in your garden and forever fund his lifestyle and that of all the family he wants to immigrate from the old country to this land of dole and NHS.
"Would you fill your entire garden with people less fortunate than yourself from all over the world?"
"No I would not. Sadly there is a limit to my financial resources and my ability to fund such a work of charity" " was the reply of the Lefy fuckwitt.
The Prophet then asked the Fuckwitt. "If you, as a well off lefty middle class sandal wearing vegan cannot afford to fund such a charitable immigration scheme due to a lack of resources. Why do you think such a scheme is acceptable in the poorest areas of the cities and right across a country?"
"How can you expect your country to afford such spending on a national scale when they are financially in the shit?"
The lefty fuckewitt thought for a moment and then realised that those opposing immigration are concerned about the financial stability of the country and the future we leave to our children.
It is not that they do not care but there is a limit to the amount of help that can be given.
(In this parrable the lefty was black and the immigrant was a roma gypsy)
It is not about race it is about finance. Unlimited and uncontrolled immigration leads to conflict and chaos.
Forgot to add that they all lived happily ever after in their own respective countries.
DL said "Do you give each other 'high fives' and all that Blacky stuff?"
Hahahahahaha,you crack me up ;)
Stanners, I'm pleased. I had a smile on my face when I wrote it! Mind you, you look a cheery kind of 'high-five' man in your avatar.
Stanners, BTW do you have any opinions on subjects other than race. Your comments are well thought out, if wrong, come on and comment on other subjects and you never know you might be right for once!
Stan,
I believe all people are created equally. Their subsequentl development is determined by environment. A persons development is certainly affected by the society and education they experience.
If it was Chinese or European living in Africa in tribal communities then they would be unwelcome much in the same way I feel about other mass Imigration.
It is not about colour it is about cultural development.
Joking aside It is not intended to be malicious but simply my personal opinion. I do accept history is full of examples of mans inhumanity to others. Every race and culture have blood on their hands. Every leader scheming to pursue advantage for themselves over others.
I live in the Highlands where our ancestors were evicted from their homes by powerful landlords often related to those same people. They sent some to plantations, USA, Canada, etc. If this is how they treated family why are we surprised at the treatment of people in Africa.
It was.not because they were white. It was because they were rich and powerful and took whatever they could from anyone weaker.
It is the same greed that exists in every culture. A culture with no self interest would not survive. It is that same survival of culture that drives immigration. They want what we have and we want to keep what we have got. Is it so offensive to wish to avoid cultural, economic and social suicide?
No small nation culture in history has ever survived such population influx. Invasion, immigration or enhancement it does matter what you call it the change is irreversible.
When you add a lot of people with great business skills and money they positively enhance a society spurring further development and the reverse is true when you add an illiterate goat herder with a dream of martyrdom and a desire to dress in semtex.
Either control it or allow it but there is no point denying it. I believe control it as our continued existence is too valuable to gamble.
I typed that all from my phone. Took fucking ages my computer was just in next room. Numpty
2Mac, That was a very thoughtful and well constructed comment. The thought however of you typing it on your phone is amazing. It would take me about an hour to type that on mine. I can't even type of the fucking computer, although as I have now swapped to Google chrome from Internet Explorer as well as it being much faster to load it also has a facility which highlights typing mistakes, so I should improve. The whole crux of your comment was basically, you've got it and we want it as opposed to we've got it and you're not getting it. We have made the mistakes in our development which they have yet to explore. It's a bit like the big brother syndrome. I have a younger brother by 2.5 years and when we were growing up I always felt that the things that I had to fight to get, he got automatically after me. One such item that sticks in my mind was believe it or not, slip on shoes. Now my father was pretty 'old school' and in my teens when slip on shoes became fashionable, I had to argue for about 2 years before I got a pair. Fuck me, I hadn't got them for 2 months when my brother got a pair. Can you see the analogy? Obtuse I agree, but there you are!
Ello 2Mac,
I passed through the highlands on my way to the Isle of Lewis a few years back,your a lucky man its a beautiful place to live and I understand why you are protective of it.If I lived there I wouldn`t want a load of outsiders infesting the place.
You said,
Either control it (immigration) or allow it but there is no point denying it. I believe control it as our continued existence is too valuable to gamble.
I agree,I have never advocated mass uncontrolled immigration,its wrong for so many reasons I don`t know where to start , I`m not a fan of Islam either.
Stanners, if you've been to Lewis, then you'll have understood why we don't want immigrants and you have been joshing with me. I am mystified however why you think it's ok for Rastafarians to come here but not a gentle Muslim from say Morocco? I mean if we have to have immigration I could put up with some olive skinned Arab chappies.
Hey up chuck,
I dont mind anyone coming here so long as they are law abiding and not expecting hand outs...
Stanners, that's the difference. I expect them not to want handouts and be law abiding, but I do mind who comes here.
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